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MESSAGES IN THIS FORUM ARE PRESENTED AS NEWEST TO OLDEST.

Hello, What are the conclusions of the study? SONEC is the most important area for spring staging pintail? The Alaska and Prairie populations migrate north at different times? The birds basically distribute according to the May survey, so we can trust the survey data? Will you publish the conclusions here? Thanks, Jeff

Moderator's Response: Jeff, Well, you're partly right: SONEC is the most important spring stopover for California wintering pintails, and Alaska and Prairie-bound hens migrate at different times. However, we have shown that pintails going directly to Alaska hold in SONEC for a couple of months before departing, whereas prairie birds leave there quickly if they use additional stopovers, or delay their departure a month or so if they will fly directly to Canada, usually Alberta. We have verified that the May Survey misses pintails, which tend to be in unsurveyed areas, especially when the prairies are dry. We will provide a 2003 link button on the home page soon that will show summaries of migration routes and other data.

Is the pintail study still ongoing? Today is julian date 306 but I see entries for birds in New Mexico for dates above 306. Is this last year's data. Also, am I doing something wrong or is the option for the smaller scaled, more detail state map no longer available...Thanks

Moderator's Response: All transmitters have stopped providing locations. The project is completed.

Why does the tracking update stop at august 30?

Moderator's Response: All transmitters have stopped providing locations

Correct me if I'm wrong but over the years of this study it doesn't appear that the few remaining Alaska pintails still giving locations in late August and into September return very quickly to California. That is they don't return by September 20 or even Oct 1. Does this mean that the pintail we see in the Klamath Basin and the Central Valley in August and most of September are Prairie Canada birds? Or is this too sweeping of a generalization because the remaining sample may be too small to accurately reflect the larger population?

Moderator's Response: Kurt, Good question. Our sample sizes are, indeed, too small to support conclusions. For example, in 2001, one bird returned to the Klamath Basin on 29 September as another returned to the Central Valley from the southern Yukon via northern B.C. and eastern Montana. Another arrived in southern Idaho from southeast Saskatchewan on 30 September and moved down to the Central Valley on 13 October, while another arrived in the Valley from southern Alberta on 5 October and another from Alaska on 12 October. One hen was shot on Alaska's Kenai Peninsula in October on her way south. So, seems that arrival times in CA might be unrelated to geographic location. To study fall migration, PTTs need to remain active for 12 months after attachment in winter.

Have you heard of any new reports on brood success for the year? We are all crossing our fingers for good production with the improved water conditions. Thanks again for all the great work you guys are doing for pintails.john.

Moderator's Response: John, The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, Division of Migratory Bird Management maintains a web site that includes all breeding population and production reports (http://migratorybirds.fws.gov/reports/reports.html). Check it out. They've posted only 1 production report so far: southern Saskatchewan. I paraphrase from the abstract: "Average to below average precip across southern SK during June/July. July pond indices 17% higher than in 2002 (drought year), but 36% and 11% below 10-year and long-term means. However, overall brood index 271%, 56%, and 7% higher than 2002, 10-year, and long-term means. Excellent recruitment might result from south-central areas of the survey unit."

Regarding the Sac Valley birds I’m wondering if your study may have picked up some smaller regional movement patterns. For example, I’ve heard hunters espouse a theory that, although I don’t necessarily subscribe to it, it does sound plausible and it is this: Birds leave the valley and fly to San Francisco Bay spending several days there at a time using the salt water to rid themselves of lice. I’ve also heard that when the valley is socked in with fog for days at a time people on the coast will observe an increase in waterfowl. On a clear day around December 10 in 1998 I was at the Bolinas-Stinson Lagoon and was surprised by the large number of pintail that were present. During your study did you ever observe any movement of pintail towards the coast?

Moderator's Response: Kurt, The satellite project was not designed to track in-state movements, but it works pretty well, nonetheless. However, in the 4 years of pinsat, during the months of December-February, only one bird moved to SF Bay from the Valley, and then only for one day. This is a similar result from our work in the late 1980s to mid-1990s using standard telemetry from September to March, when only one or two birds made that move - fog or no fog, and lice or no lice! From the San Joaquin Valley (standard telemetry), a few more birds made their way to the Bay, but again not to the degree you are talking about. Perhaps SF Bay pintails that come and go are those moving along the coast.

I thought pintail were considered to be nomadic birds but it appears that once they settle on their wintering grounds they don’t move that much. In the four years of this study not one pintail migrated south to Mexico from the Sacramento Valley. I believe the farthest south several birds flew was Kern NWR. In the past two years the pintail caught in the Texas Panhandle hardly moved until spring migration. There was no movement of birds between the Texas Panhandle and the Gulf Coast and vice versa. Most of the New Mexico birds stayed within a narrow geographic range. Those that did move to Mexico, once they arrived, appeared to stay in their respective locations for the entire winter. What do you make of this?

Moderator's Response: Kurt, You have summarized the winter biology of the pintail pretty well! They do show strong fidelity to particular wintering regions. In spring, too, certain subpopulations, such as those heading off to Alaska, show strong fidelity while others, such as those associated with the prairies, do not. There is still much to be learned about this species.

Well done Mike..This year's returning hens to the prairies sure squares up with the recent breeding pair survey from the FWS. It's almost a perfect proportion with the birds in Alaska and Saskatchewan as to the marked birds in the same areas. This year's timely concentrations must make the overall study very satisfying. Thanks!!

Moderator's Response: Hi Frank, Yup, we're plum tickled that our PTT-tagged hens appear to have settled in the breeding areas roughly the same way the general unmarked population did. We originally planned Pinsat for 4 years just to make sure we'd get at least one wet year and one drought year. This is the wet one, last year was the drought, and the first two years were in between, but basically dry with wet spots here and there. Thanks for your support and interest in our project over the years. Looks like we'll have a lot more sprig winging around this fall/winter!

I read that you are going to elaborate all three years data to give a complete scenario of pintail spring migration and ecology. I would be pleased to know where your results will be published and when, in order to find them in literature. Such study could be very important also for european pintail population. Thank you very much for information.

Moderator's Response: Michele, Thanks for your interest. We will try to publish our results in the Journal of Wildlife Management, Condor, etc. It might be as long as 2 years before the results appear in print because of the long review process. It's all up to the journal editors whether and when any manuscript gets published!

Several issues among MS Flyway waterfowlers and bilogists have recently increases awareness of and demand for telemetry studies on both mallards and pintails that winter here. I have a few questions: 1. Why do we see pintail telemetry being done in all flyways EXCEPT the MS? 2. What should be do to change that? 3. What is the cost/bird and other logisital considerations? 4. Is there work being done we're not aware of? 5. Where should people go to help out and make it happen?

Moderator's Response: 1. Probably lack of funding and/or a research question. 2. Check with your state waterfowl association, Department of Fish and Wildlife, and USGS or other Wildlife Research Centers in MS/LA that have a history of waterfowl research. 3. Cost is $2100-3100 per unit with an additional cost of $1000 for the data! 4. All pintail satellite tracking work is linked on our website: CA, TX, NM, and SC. 5. See #2 above. Good luck!

Is it possible to gauge how quickly pintails move through the Peace region en route to more northerly nesting areas? We are looking at survey frequency on the Hay Zama Lakes complex and what the turnover rate might be.

Moderator's Response: Yes. Here's the schedules for the 5 pintails that went through Grande Prairie this spring: 39533 - 4/17 (nw of Edmonton), 4/20-5/10 (G.P.), 5/13 (NWT); 39536 - 4/24 (wsw of Edmonton), 4/27-30 (G.P.), 5/3 (Alaska); 39540 - 4/14 (e of Stavely), 4/17-5/13 (G.P.), 5/16 (Alaska); 39541 - 5/2 (n of Edmonton), 5/5-9) (G.P.), 5/12 (Alaska); 39545 - 4/16 (s of Edmonton), 4/18-23 (G.P.), 4/26-29 (Peace River), 5/2 (northern B.C.), 5/5 (Yukon). As you can see, resident time in GP ranged from a few days to nearly a month. Small sample size, but I would guess this pattern might hold annually given the wide range in number of days.

Hello, I just finished reading the journal and noticed the numerous PTT failures all of a sudden. How many are confirmed dead birds?

Moderator's Response: Derrick, We won't be able to confirm PTT status one way or the other until the end of June. At the rate we're losing them, and we might be down to just 16 from CA and 4 from NM now, there may not be many left by then. At that time, we will look at all the technical data and make a final determination. As a first cut, as always there appears to be a mixture of PTT tech failure and bird mortality; I'd guess about 70/30 mortality to PTT fail at this point. The PTTs were programmed to last through June.

Even with the outstanding water conditions, some of the pintail are leaving Saskatchewan for the Northern Territories and Alaska. Is this due to homing, hens returning to sites where they were hatched or may have nested in previous years? Have any conclusions been made about nesting success in Alaska and the Northwest Territories versus Southern Saskatchewan and Alberta. The conventional wisdom has always been that the PPH was better. If that's the case why would they go north if they don't have to.

Moderator's Response: John, Checking my records I note that all California pintails that have gone to Alaska have migrated directly or gone through Alberta very quickly and so, probably were "homing" there. I note that no CA birds in Saskatchewan have gone north to Alaska, Yukon, or NWT - all the northern migrants went through Alberta. One NM bird went to NWT from northern Alberta (the rest are still in the prairies), and of TX birds, only 1 has migrated far north. Nesting success in northern areas and in the prairies is about equal now, having declined in the prairies over time. The key to bringing back pintail populations is to raise success in the prairies again.

Your response to the question about the effect of snow on nesting was very depressing, given the recent weather in Alberta. It seems like April and early May would be extremely early for birds--even pintails--to nest in Alberta, (or N. Dakota, for that matter), given it's relatively northern latitude. Would the hens you've been tracking already be sitting in nests in Alberta? I had been hoping that we would still have time for the recent snows to melt...seems like pins just never get a break from mother nature or agriculture.

Moderator's Response: John, Don't be depressed - most of the snow has melted (check our snow water equivalents link on the Migration Maps page). Pintails begin nesting in Alberta, Saskatchewan, and North Dakota early, usually by midApril or so, or earlier if warm conditions are encountered. Thus, they are vulnerable to weather events. But we've had hens in one place for some time, indicating they might be nesting, and there is still time for good production of ducklings this year. I expect a good year for pintails.

Most of southern Alberta woke on Sunday, May 4 to a blanket of snow. At Brooks, we had 6 to 8 inches of heavy, wet snow on the ground and it continued to snow for two more days. Brooks has received almost 70mm (2.75 inches)of precipitation since March 1. We had good soil moisture conditions in the fall and so far, this has been a very wet spring. Knowing the dates the pintails arrived in southern Alberta, would hens be nesting at this time? How would this snowy weather affect their nesting attempts? Would it cause most hens to renest? Thank you.

Moderator's Response: Sue, Heavy wet snow atop nesting hen pintails would not be a good thing. In North Dakota, Krapu (1977. Pintail reproduction hampered by snowfall and agriculture. Wilson Bulletin 89:154-157) discovered that a 10cm snowfall during 18-19 April 1970 did not cause pintail hens to stop laying eggs, but they probably just dumped them here and there because right after the storm, pairs started showing up in large numbers indicating nest abandonment on a large scale. Additionally, the bad weather delayed cultivation in farm fields to a time that coincided with the renesting efforts of pintails, thereby resulting in nest loss over a vast region.

I believe I have read in posts from previous years that pintail that take the circuitous route to Alaska thru Alberta in dry years probably do not nest. Based on your latest statement that some hens will apparently pass thru Alberta even in wet years to reach Alaska my question is this: Do we need to rethink the theory that hens that follow this route in dry years do not attempt to nest?

Moderator's Response: Kurt, Good question! My understanding of the various data sets is that pintails that "overfly" drought ravaged prairies to northern regions do not, on average, recruit young to the fall population at the same rate as when they nest in wet prairies. Rates would be averages of all birds heading north, those that did so because their first choice was dry and those that were going there anyway. The latter may recruit at a good rate but are cancelled out by those that "sit it out" until the next year.

Mike, after reviewing the latest locations, it appears that Southern Saskatchewan has stolen the show this year from the Pacific Flyway. It seems that the most of the seven California birds moved straight east to the Old Wives lake area from S.Alberta. That seems like a lot. Do you think these hens have sensed the more "attractive" or prime wetlands nesting sites there rather than staying in S.Alberta...or just the usual migration traversing to their "favorite" spot?

Moderator's Response: Frank, Saskatchewan or Bust is the guide post for sprig this year. Based on movement patterns of our PTT-tagged hens over the last 4 years, I would suggest that some pintails coming through southern Alberta keep going north to Alaska, even if the prairies are wet, and others work their way east south of the Parklands as they search for acceptable wetland conditions in which to nest, with many winding up in SK. Although southern AB is in great shape, apparently SK is even better and over a much broader area. That CA, TX, and NM birds are there indicates just how good. Let's hope duckling production and fledging rates are just as good this summer! A large share of those will return to CA.

I lived in Juneau Alaska as a deck hand on a wildlife tour boat last summer and had a chance to take a trip around Glacier Bay for one of our excursions. The trip to GB was in late September and there were a few ducks around the flats in the area. Most of the birds were wigeon and some mallards there also were a fair number of honkers. Do you think pintail 39549 will stay to nest here in south east of keep on going north. What does the western Alaskan terrain have that differs from south east. I broke out my DeLorme map tonight and looked where Taylor Bay was and that was one of the Glaciers that we stopped to look at last September (Brady Glacier). It's a small world.

Moderator's Response: Mike, Well it's definitely a small world if you're a pintail! If history is an accurate guide, 39549 will head to the Yukon-Kuskokwim Delta (YKD)soon. Western Alaska, specifically the YKD, is vast flat and filled with shallow lakes - just what your average sprig is looking for. There are many other similar, though smaller, such deltas in the west of Alaska. These areas are the nursery for the largest share of the Pacific Flyways swans, geese, and for many species, ducks (especially when the prairies are dry). In contrast, the southeast deltas are smaller, isolated, with more trees; not as attractive to pintails, although the Copper River Delta is a critical nesting area too.

Thanks again for all the great work. I have just a couple questions. First, I hunt over in the Klamath Basin. We tend to see most pins later in the season, but it is not unusual to see small numbers of them in October. To what extent do pins nest in Oregon, or are these birds more likely early migrants from up north? Also, I noticed that a large number of birds are now in Alberta and Saskatchawan. At what point will they head to Alaska and the Parklands if nesting conditions are bleak? I assume that we'll have a good idea of production this year just by watching the map to see if they stay put.

Moderator's Response: John, There are 400-600 pairs of pintails counted on Klamath NWR complex lands each spring, and there are many other areas where pintails do nest in eastern OR; however, the October birds likely are from molting or nesting areas in Canada and Alaska. Nesting conditions are pretty good this spring in southern Canada, so we would expect fewer hens to pass through. At this time, 3 hens have made it to Alaska and a few are in northern Alberta, and these are probably on their way to Alaska as well, or perhaps Northwest Territories. Many PTT-tagged hens remaining in the southern provinces and the Dakotas will mean a strong nesting effort.

I am writing from south central Saskatchewan and am very saddened that the survey is coming to an end. I have followed it from the beginning and found it very interesting. I was happy to see birds being tracked from New.Mexico and Texas as the birds from California were staying west of us until this spring. as I write this we are in our second snow storm in as many weeks. The outlook is very promising for nesting in our area due to ponds that haven't been around for years. It's to bad the research couldn't continue into wet years as well as drought as I noticed more pintails last fall in the migration than I have seen for a long time. Congratulations on a job well done.

Moderator's Response: Randy, Thanks for your kind words and the first hand report on great potential for nesting in pintail country this year. We are still tracking marked hens, as we aren't done yet, and looks like this will be the wet prairie year we were hoping to get during the project. Unless birds are adversely affected by the transmitters, we should see a much larger proportion of our PTT-tagged sample remain in the prairies.

Very interesting that 70% of the sample went straight to the prairies this year. That seems higher than the last few seasons. Do you think that pintail could possibly remember whether conditions were favorable from the previous fall and then choose to go to the prairies? Southern Saskatchewan was very wet last October, and perhaps the birds remember that. Just a thought. - Jeff

Moderator's Response: Jeff, That could be true, but we know that the majority of birds go through southern Alberta and Saskatchewan, in any event. So, whether or not they stay there or move north may depend upon wetland conditions they encounter. Many reports that this is a very wet spring in prairie areas important to pintails.

Mike- I know it is early and the May pond survey hasn't been conducted, but can you give us some feedback as to the wetland conditions (Alberta, Western Sask.)pintails will encounter. From the drought watch maps in Canada, it appears o.k.??

Moderator's Response: Check out the new Journal page. At the end, I attached a note that seems to indicate pretty good wetland conditions in the prairies this spring. The May Survey starts 1 May and we'll know more about duck and pond numbers shortly after that gets rolling. About 70% of our PTT-tagged hens are in southern Alberta and southern Saskatchewan now. Keep your fingers crossed.

Gentlemen, WOW! How time flies when you have fun. I remeber the fist time I heard of this aventure, and I logged on due to my deep love of the pintail. It was three yrs ago while I was still in college. I hate to see this study end, but to all good things must have and end. i would like to say thank you not only to the reasearchers, but to the ground crews, the poeple who donated the money to the study,and most importantly to the scientest behind the idea. I have enjoyed countless hours of data searching and watched the birds transgress through the dought in their search for natural cover to do what their instintcs tell them to due. I am so glad to have watched what I would say has to be the most respected study on waterfowl to date.

Moderator's Response: Pintail Charlie: Thank you so much for your kind words! We have enjoyed doing this study and providing our discoveries through this web site as much as you have enjoyed using it. But, we aren't done yet, as the 2003 migration is in full swing. The prairies have some water this year, so maybe pintails are going to get a break this year. Thanks again for your interest in the pintail.

we have a pair of pintails who have been on this lake in callands, va. all winter. 1 egg was laid this morning. how long till it hatches. they are a very devoted pair.

Moderator's Response: Jim, Interesting observation - my waterfowl and general bird books suggest pintails do not nest in Virginia! Pintail incubation begins within 24 hours of the last egg laid, and clutch size is up to 12 eggs. Total incubation period is 22-24 days, so you could expect ducklings in a month or so. Within a few days after the hen begins incubation, you will note that the male will spend less and less time at his "waiting area" and eventually will disappear. He will be heading elsewhere to join postbreeding flocks. I don't have any information on where that may be for pintails nesting in your area.

Hi Mike, "It's been awhile" As I'm looking at the northern migration this year, it appears that the birds in the west seem a little more organized as they head north inland. A lot more staging in south east Oregon..mabey weather? I was glad to hear from the fellow in Alberta about the still frozen potholes and run-off..sounds like a more normal thaw this year. Whats your read??

Moderator's Response: Frank, There have been some differences in migration routes this year so far, with more use of central/eastern Washington and Bear River marshes in Utah. Staging in southeast Oregon and northeast California seem to be in line with previous years. Yes, it does sound like things are a little better water-wise in Alberta; however, if you check our drought links on the migration map page you will see that southwest SK and southeast AB are still only so so.